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#1 ONLINE   nolafan33

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Posted 11 June 2016 - 04:41 PM

Meaning, take the Pels for example, having Ingram on my list isn't realistic. But a guy like Dragan Bender, COULD be. What is your top 5? I guess feel free to debate if a guy is realistic to be in that draft spot as well.
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#2 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 11 June 2016 - 04:48 PM

1. Jaylen Brown
2. Dragan Bender
3. Buddy Hield
4. Kris Dunn
5. Jamal Murray
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#3 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 11 June 2016 - 04:53 PM

1. Marquese Chriss

2. Deyonta Davis

3. Domantas Sabonis

4. Henry Ellenson

5. Tyler Ulis


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#4 ONLINE   nolafan33

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 02:49 PM

1. Murray

2. Bender

3. Dunn

4. Hield

5. Chriss

 

Think the Porzingis comparison for Bender is lazy, he's more of a Nirotic/Saric type of guy.  Think comparisons for Murray, Dunn, and Hield is Lillard, a bigger Bledsoe, and Mitch Richmond.


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#5 OFFLINE   buzzy

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 02:51 PM

1. Dylan

2. Dylan

3. Dylan

4. Dylan

5. Dylan


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#6 OFFLINE   Boogie

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 09:30 PM

1. Kris Dunn
2. Marquese Chriss
3. Jamal Murray
4. Jaylen Brown
5. Dejounte Murray
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#7 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 09:47 PM

1. Dragan Bender
2. Jaylen Brown
3. Buddy Hield
4. Jamal Murray
5. Kris Dunn


A little update to my list after doing more research

I love Jaylen, and really hope there is some way we can get him. But it's becoming more apparent as I do more research that Bender will be ready quicker than I realized. He will absolutely be the #3 pick in the draft -- just a question whether it's Boston or someone else. If he gains a good bit of weight, let's say 20lbs even of muscle, I think he's playable this year now. Probably not a lot, but nothing to say he can't get the 15mpg that Jerebko got.

His defense is going to be elite in the NBA, and all he really needs to do is get stronger and more acclimated to the game itself.
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#8 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 03:02 PM

1. Kris Dunn
2. Marquese Chriss
3. Jamal Murray
4. Jaylen Brown
5. Dejounte Murray

what team is this for? you don't have your favorite teams listed besides the Sharks

 

A little update to my list after doing more research

I love Jaylen, and really hope there is some way we can get him. But it's becoming more apparent as I do more research that Bender will be ready quicker than I realized. He will absolutely be the #3 pick in the draft -- just a question whether it's Boston or someone else. If he gains a good bit of weight, let's say 20lbs even of muscle, I think he's playable this year now. Probably not a lot, but nothing to say he can't get the 15mpg that Jerebko got.

His defense is going to be elite in the NBA, and all he really needs to do is get stronger and more acclimated to the game itself.

still think you're too high on Jaylen but welcome on board the Bender bandwagon we've been waiting for you and yeah imo he'll be just as immediately ready as Jaylen if not much more, a much better fit for the Celtics and huge upside with his quickness and handles and perimeter defense for a big man (I don't think his pro position is SF I think it just might look like that to some now since he has more development to do on his interior skills than perimeter)


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#9 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 03:21 PM

still think you're too high on Jaylen but welcome on board the Bender bandwagon we've been waiting for you and yeah imo he'll be just as immediately ready as Jaylen if not much more, a much better fit for the Celtics and huge upside with his quickness and handles and perimeter defense for a big man (I don't think his pro position is SF I think it just might look like that to some now since he has more development to do on his interior skills than perimeter)

they are two different prospects altogether 

 

 

Jaylen is the prospect that fits best in the Celtics system right away. Solid in the P&R as the ball handler, excellent in transition, very solid at attacking the basket, etc. He'd average 20-26mpg as a rookie for the Celtics, coming on in the 2nd unit with Smart, and giving Crowder the proper rest when necessary. Brown is a SF/SG that could potentially play some PF if really needed for some reason. He allows to switch defensively on the perimeter with Crowder, Smart, and Bradley on off-ball screens.

 

Bender is the long term fit and his potential fits Boston quite well, though. He's someone that will be guarding the 3pt SF guys often, hence why he's a SF in my book in base-lineups. He's not a low post defender at all, and would get abused in those matchups. He'll guard the perimeter and crash in as a weakside help defender around the basket. He's best suited though to be a stretch 4, where he'd guard the same personnel of player. Someone like Harrison Barnes for example. And when he's on bigger PFs, he'll be very good in icing the P&R and picking up the ball handler. His offense needs a ton of work, and he'd get 10-15mpg most likely, with a ton of trips down to Maine for development.

 

I'm fine with either of these two guys, although I prefer Jaylen. 


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#10 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 03:31 PM

they are two different prospects altogether 

 

 

Jaylen is the prospect that fits best in the Celtics system right away. Solid in the P&R as the ball handler, excellent in transition, very solid at attacking the basket, etc. He'd average 20-26mpg as a rookie for the Celtics, coming on in the 2nd unit with Smart, and giving Crowder the proper rest when necessary. Brown is a SF/SG that could potentially play some PF if really needed for some reason. He allows to switch defensively on the perimeter with Crowder, Smart, and Bradley on off-ball screens.

 

Bender is the long term fit and his potential fits Boston quite well, though. He's someone that will be guarding the 3pt SF guys often, hence why he's a SF in my book in base-lineups. He's not a low post defender at all, and would get abused in those matchups. He'll guard the perimeter and crash in as a weakside help defender around the basket. He's best suited though to be a stretch 4, where he'd guard the same personnel of player. Someone like Harrison Barnes for example. And when he's on bigger PFs, he'll be very good in icing the P&R and picking up the ball handler. His offense needs a ton of work, and he'd get 10-15mpg most likely, with a ton of trips down to Maine for development.

 

I'm fine with either of these two guys, although I prefer Jaylen. 

Bender>>>>Jaylen but you are right that they're two entirely different prospects. I meant long-term SF isn't Bender's positions but yeah right now he has work to do on his interior defense including needing to add size/strength. But once that happens he'll be a complete and great defender, imo a defense-only comparison is Steven Adams. And yeah long-term I see him being a stretch-4 who can play center in certain lineups, helps that offensively he can take the rebound and run and he can legitimately handle it better than most bigs


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#11 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 04:07 PM

He is 0% similar to Steven Adams


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#12 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 04:08 PM

He is 0% similar to Steven Adams

his defensive versatility is, he can be a big man in your lineup but defend just as well on the perimeter as the interior


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#13 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 04:20 PM

But Adams is a physical menace down low with enough quickness to contest some perimeter shots, and Bender is a perimeter defender that if he gained 30lbs of muscle could eventually develop into a solid low-post defender.

 

 

Not similar at all


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#14 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 04:24 PM

fair, and to be clear I wasn't saying that's what he is now I was saying he could become a Steven Adams type of defender in terms of how you could use him in your lineup/what he allows you to do on defense

 

as we've discussed he needs to add strength for his post defense but he could be a really good on-ball defender in the post as well, he's not a weakside shot blocker or rim protector in that sense but on the ball (even in the post) he does a good job contesting shots


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#15 ONLINE   nolafan33

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 05:08 PM

Bosox said Jaylen Brown is solid in the PnR lololol

Shows how much you actually know about the guy.

And good luck getting a low IQ guy like him to be capable of making the reads to switch on screens. That would be a disaster.
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#16 OFFLINE   bosoxlover12

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 05:36 PM

Bosox said Jaylen Brown is solid in the PnR lololol

Shows how much you actually know about the guy.

That's straight from the Kevin O'Connor draft guide, bruh. 

 

I feel like you are more constructing your arguments based off of me saying it, and assuming its wrong, rather than actually evaluating the statement. He really is solid for a wing in the P&R. But keep on just saying what you want for your own narrative. 


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#17 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 05:50 PM

Via DraftExpress' Matt Kamalsky:

 

"Asked to fill a substantial role in Cal's space-starved offense, Brown did most of his damage playing off the ball spotting up or filling lanes in transition, but was also granted significant opportunities to create for himself off the bounce in the half court. Given considerable freedom, the freshman scored just .853 points per possession over 17.2 possessions per game to rank 149th in scoring efficiency among the 173 players using over 17 opportunities per game according to Synergy Sports Technology."

 

"Possessing a strong first step and impressive leaping ability off of one and two feet, Brown's fairly loose handle, lack of craftiness around the basket, and tendency to get tunnel vision and force shots into traffic led to his 45% shooting around the rim in the half court and top-100 leading per-40 minute pace adjusted turnover rate."

 

Translation: The majority of Brown's offense right now comes from fast breaks, straight-line drives and cuts to the rim. He is not someone you want to depend on in the PnR

 

Here's the link to that scouting report and fwiw you should definitely watch Mike Schmitz's scouting videos (Jaylen's are on that link) if you don't already


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#18 ONLINE   nolafan33

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 06:13 PM

That's straight from the Kevin O'Connor draft guide, bruh. 
 
I feel like you are more constructing your arguments based off of me saying it, and assuming its wrong, rather than actually evaluating the statement. He really is solid for a wing in the P&R. But keep on just saying what you want for your own narrative. 


O'Connor is wrong then, sounds like you may have wasted that $7.50 on someone who doesn't know what they're talking about. When you successfully converted a low percentage of PnR plays and likewise had a high turnover rate, you aren't "solid." You're bad. I said it yesterday, Brown can't be asked to isolate or be given the ball and asked to orchestrate around a ball screen.

I'd also really stress to you to actually go watch the guy and not rely on someone elses (who clearly missed the mark on Browns scouting) opinion. When it became apparent that the Pels would have a good selection I was VERY intrigued by Jaylen Brown, then I jumped into all the information I could find and watched as much of him as I could (have numerous recorded games on my DVR) and I was incredibly underwhelmed. He wasn't even a good college player, and you think he's one of the top 4 prospects in this class?
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#19 OFFLINE   Stray32

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 06:18 PM

He's got the perfect package of size and athleticism for a wing. But in terms of actual skills - consistent mechanics on his jumper, better handle, better vision creating for himself or others - he has a ways to go. Which is why I've strongly disagreed every time you (bosox) talk about him being ready out of the gate as an NBA player even relatively speaking


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#20 ONLINE   nolafan33

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Posted 13 June 2016 - 07:08 PM

I've said it before but Browns physical profile and upside is what's intriguing, that's the only reasons he's projected to go in the top 10. The fact that bosox thinks he's ready to see 10-12 minutes a night, much less 20-26 is laughable and one of those infamous mis/uninformed bosox statements. The guy was essentially a very average college basketball player with underdeveloped skills coupled with times of lazy play and a low basketball IQ. An 18 PER is what the 15 PER is to the NBA, and you look at the other top wings or guards in this class, like Ingram at 22.5, Murray at 23.4, Dunn at 23.2, and Buddy at 28.8, it's clear Jaylen Brown doesn't stack up to those guys with a measly 18.7.
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